Licencing requriements for Motorhomes in other provinces

While I was waiting for a response from the ministry on Email protocol and before I send my Email requesting a change to the licencing requirements for motorhomes,  I decided to have a cursory look at web sites from other provinces and territories in Canada.  I've provided references if you want to investigate for yourselves.

Province	Required Licence and reference data	Ontario Equivalent
British Columbia	Class 5 or 7 Licence                             http://www.icbc.com/driver-licensing/getting-licensed/types-licences#5 Text “Motor homes (including those with more than 2 axles)”	G-Licence
Alberta	Class 5                                                   http://www.servicealberta.ca/Drivers_Licence.cfm#Class_5_Licence text "(2-axle - Cars, Light Trucks, Motor Homes or Mopeds)"	G-Licence
Saskatchewan	Class 7                   http://www.sgi.sk.ca/sgi_pub/drivers_licences/classifications/class_7.htm 3-axle motorhomes	G-Licence
Manitoba	Class 5                                   http://www.mpi.mb.ca/english/brochures/brochures.html  select "Manitoba's Class Licence System" Then go to page 15 of the Brochure Motorhome not mentioned specifically	G-Licence
Quebec	Class 5                                                   http://www.saaq.gouv.qc.ca/en/driver_licence/classes/class_5.php text "motor home; "            Note weight not specified	G-Licence
New Brunswick	Class 5 NB Reference                       text "any three-axle motor vehicle, other than a truck, of a type designed for use in the construction, maintenance and repair of highways, whether or not the vehicle is to be so used"	G-Licence
Nova Scotia	Class 3                                                   http://www.gov.ns.ca/snsmr/paal/rmv/paal269.asp text  "Class 3 -- for driving vehicles or vehicle-trailer combinations weighing greater than 14,000 kilograms;" Note: no reference to Air Brakes	D-Licence
PEI	Class 3                                   http://www.gov.pe.ca/tir/index.php3?number=20138&lang=E text "Class 3 - Straight truck and trailer combination over 14,000 kg" Note: no reference to Air Brakes	D-Licence
Yukon	Class 5                                                   http://icandrive.ca/yukon/class-5-license/ ·         Class 5 license and drive with full driving privileges	G-Licence
NWT	Class 5           http://www.dot.gov.nt.ca/_live/pages/wpPages/drivers_vehicles_home.aspx Click on Basic Licence Drivers Handbook then page down to "Class 5" on page 14	G-Licence

Please feel free to check the data and let me know what you think.  This by no means, is in-depth research - it is just cruising the provinces' web sites.

Gaining support for the licencing change

Last night I talked to Gaetan Ladouceur, the Provincial Director of the Ontario Good Sam Club.  He supports our position on changing the licencing requirements for operating large motorohomes.  This is a hot issue with them as well.

Ontario Good Sam's will be having a Samboree this weekend.  He will bring up the issue with the club members who drive large motorhomes.  I suspect, like the OTT, they will support our effort for change.  I have Email him a draft of my MOT letter.  It's nice to know that we are not alone.  Check out the Ontario Good Sam web site

drafting the letter to MOT

I have drafted the letter to the Ministry of Transportation requesting a change to the licencing for operating large motorhomes from a D-licence to a more appropriate G-licence.  I will wait a day or two, take the time to ponder and review it before I send it.

Watch for updates.

OTT appoints me to discuss licencing requirement with the MOT

I love the monthly Ontario Trillium Travellers (OTT) outings.  Getting together with friends and sharing experiences is always exciting.  A new Ontario campground every month, provides us with new things to see and do.

This August outing was the not much different until we had a meeting and discussed the licencing requirements to drive motorhomes of the size of ours.  You see, Bettyann and I had just got the required D-Licence and shared how costly and down-right ridiculus it was for the MOT to require us to have it.

Like us most folks didn't even know that there was such a requirement.  So, at our business meeting on Saturday the OTT appointed me to send a requiest to the ministry to reconsider the licencing requirements for Class A motorhomers.

If you have been following my blog you'll know that Bettyann and I documented our experience and our opinion about requiring a D-licence for RVers.  Having presented our findings and discussing with the OTT they share our point of view on this. 

... Now on to the job of presenting our view to the ministry.  I'll keep you all posted.

What should be the licencing requirements to operate large motorhomes? My opinion.

Having obtained the required licencing to legally operate our motorhome,  I would like to reflect on those requirements.  Currently, the Ontario MOT requires that everyone driving motorhomes and towing a vehicle with a total weigh exceeding 11,000 Kgs (24,250lbs)  have a "D" commercial truck drivers licence.  I believe this to be unreasonable.  It also has a major impact on the RV industry who are already suffering from a slow economy and high fuel prices.
 D- licence requirements come with some major assumptions which are reflected in both the the D-Licnece training and in the ultimate testing by the DriveTest Centre.
With both Bettyann and I having gone through the training and having obtained the required D-licence to operate our motorhome,  we believe that it is unnecessary and definately overkill.   If every retired person, with the dream to purchase a motorhome and travel North America,  after 50 years of work, has to obtain a commercial truck drivers licence - that dream will be unnecessilarliy shattered.
The D-licence requirements is clearly focused on young healthy adults seeking employment driving a truck.  Both the training and testing reflect this.
Here is what I see as some of the assumptions - there are many more:
1.  The truck you will be driving will be owned by someone else and will not necessarily be well maintained.
2.  The driver has very little experience driving and only recently obtained a G-licence and may not be familiar all the road signs, rules and commercial truck requirements.
3.  There is a necessity to know about the mechanics of the brakes, engine components and truck sturctures.
4. etc etc etc
Let face facts,  motorhomers have made a substantial financial investment to own a motorhome.  They don't rent them and they maintain  them well.  Given it's size and cost the largest demographic are retired seniors with many years of driving experience.  I have not been able to find any statistics (I suspect that's because they don't exist) but I also suspect that the highway accident rates would be significantly less than any commercial vehicle.   Before they move, they know exactly how the vehicle will  perform.  The things you check, on a pre-trip are vastly different than those on a commercial truck.
The D-licence and the $1000, per driver, that you will spend to acquire it, is severe over-kill.  In order to obtain a D-licence you are required to:
1. Have a G-licence
2. Obtain an Air Brake Endorsement (Z-endorsement) which you have to renew through a written test every 5 years.
3. Pass an MOT required medical.
4. Obtain a driver abstract
5.  Pass the D-licence written test
6.  Pay for a training course to obtain information on the requirements to drive a commercial vehicle.   Yes, you need this to pass both the written and the driving test.
7.  Know nothing on what you actually need to operate your motorhome.
So, having gone through the process what do I believe you actually need to drive your motorhome?  A G-licence!  You've actually learned a lot by having driven various vehicles over 50 years.
By the time you finish your test drive, purchase your motorome and drive it off the dealer's lot you will have all the knowledge you need to operate your Air Brakes.  After all, the G-licence doesn't require you to understand your hydraulic brakes.  My motorhome is 40 feet long and 42,000lbs.  I know the minute I get in it, that I need to be careful how I turn it so I don't damage it taking out a stop sign cornering.  I know I have to leave extra space to accomadate stopping with the extra weight - you learn this really, really fast probably in the first 5 minutes of driving.

Fire in the Grill

Fire at the Grill

It's a sad day.   We are remembering the Margarita Grill which recently burned to the ground.  The owner Tommy was hospitalized after collapsing on the bridge on the way.  It was reported that Tommy was worried for his 62 employees.  Sammy, Tommy's son and master magician, is dealing with his dad's health as well as the loss of the business.  Our thoughts are with him.

The Margarita Grill was our favourite place in North America to eat.  It was a great atmosphere with great people and great food not to mention the best Margaritas in the world.

You can read more about the passing of this American Icon here:  The Grill Burns

We spend our winters in Crystal River and the Grill was the place we ate at least twice a week.  We have great memories of enjoying meals and Margaritas with family and friends.  It was the go to place when we had guests.


Today we raise a glass to the Margarita Grill.  I hope that Sammy chooses to rebuild - Please!

The Quest for the "D" - We got the "D" - Quest Complete!

What a successful day!  We arrived at the DriveTest Centre at about 8:15AM - Timmys in hand.  Dale and Don were already there waiting with the truck.  They offered to take us though the pre-trip again before the actual examiner got there.  Both Bettyann and I declined - we were ready!

Bettyann goes through the checks as John watches

At 9Am sharp, the examiner, John, emerged from the building and headed to the truck.  Bettyann was first and unlike the previous drive and check I was not allowed to manage the ladder.  John was very understanding about that and handled the ladder for her.  I think the adrenaline was flowing so Bettyann cruised through all the checks.  She didn't forget the "stick and start" today.  After, almost destroying one of the chalks she was off on a drive through Oshawa and onto the 401.  Twenty minutes later she had her "D-Licence."  No pressure on me.

I cruised through the checks and the drive and was luckily enough to pass too.  So, after two months of sitting in storage the Vectra is finally going back on the road.

Dale and Don From Durham

I may have mentioned this before but I have to say it again.  Choosing to take the D-Licence course at Durham was an excellent decision.  The reason I made that decision is that we couldn't take the chance of failure.  Dale and Don directed us through every aspect from the basic requirements, medical, the written test, and the drive test.  Had either Bettyann or I failed, I think they would have felt worse than we would.  And ,we would have felt really, really bad.  But really, there was no chance of that.  Thanks again to the Durham Team - Dale and Don.